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jbaulsir
Level 13

Re: Multiple pollers - one graph

Peter:

  Well put and I agree, your contribution to this board is a clear indication that your purpose is to make Orion a better product.  Converstaions like this should be a wake up call to product management to build the core from a good system into a great system.  I would like to suggest a greater interaction with the customer, I for one have been contacted twice buy SW to give input to future developments, but it seemed it was more about what they wanted to show me then see what I needed.  Anyway, off the soap box and back to work.

Jim

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pserwe
Level 12

Re: Multiple pollers - one graph

What kinds of systems, servers - platform/OS, network devices - type/transport?

I'm curious about the 10 times the systems with ten times the data and ten times less resources.

I will say that I can wholeheartedly blame the performance of my installation on the database server, it's not adequate and it's replacement is already online, just not ready to cut over to.  I also understand that should be getting better with 10, which can't be deployed until it's properly QA'd, and that unfortunately means poring through everything with a fine toothed comb.

Peter

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jbaulsir
Level 13

Re: Multiple pollers - one graph

We monitor 6000 elements on 900 nodes using one Orion server (Poller/website/DB) across 16 sites worldwide

HP DL380G5 2-dual quad 3.16 Ghz - 32 GB ram

Database is 25-30 GB most all of it in RAM (check the attachment page life >22 hours hit rate 99.9%)

monitored systems include:

Windows 2000 2003 2008 - Linux Debian Redhat - Cisco Swicthes Routers Firewalls - Citrix Netscaler Load Balencers - Juniper SSL VPN - Tipping point IPSs - APC UPSs PDUs - Detroit Diesel Generators (through APC Netbotz) - APC and DataAire AC units

Cacti/Nagios has about 90 nodes and a guy who spends 25-40% of his time maintaining it, I spend 2-5% of my time on Orion

My advice - put lots of RAM in your DB server.

Jim

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pserwe
Level 12

Re: Multiple pollers - one graph

Right now I'm doing about 200 nodes and 5500 elements if I include custom pollers on 3.3GB of RAM on both the database and the poller.  Netflow cannot be turned on Smiley Sad, but I'm well aware of why.

The new poller and database server both have 12GB, DL360G6 for the poller, and 380G6 for the database.  I spend about 40% of my time on Orion right now, trying to get it to do things it's resistant to doing.

Peter

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byrona
Level 21

Re: Multiple pollers - one graph



Right now I'm doing about 200 nodes and 5500 elements if I include custom pollers on 3.3GB of RAM on both the database and the poller.  Netflow cannot be turned on Smiley Sad, but I'm well aware of why.

The new poller and database server both have 12GB, DL360G6 for the poller, and 380G6 for the database.  I spend about 40% of my time on Orion right now, trying to get it to do things it's resistant to doing.

Peter



We were using those same system types DL360 (x2 Pollers) and DL380 (database).  We just recently built a VMWare infrastructure utilizing 3 DL360's and visualized my polling engines.  My two polling engines now share a resource pool of 750MHz of CPU and is running great (that includes APM).  We kept the database on the physical system.

I would be interested to hear what types of things you are spending your time with in Orion... however; maybe that is more appropriate for an offline discussion or a different thread.

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Neckmeats
Level 7

Re: Multiple pollers - one graph

I'm not sure why anyone even bothers requesting enhancements like this from Solarwinds. It's obvious these requests will never be addressed with anything other than "We're *planning* on adding it to the next release" or "I don't think that's representative of our user-base". So really, what's the point? The fact is, no matter how much you want to believe NPM, APM, or whaeverPM, is a mature "enterprise" product, their biggest claim to fame is that they have a user-driven support forum with over 38,000 users. WOW. It was one of the biggest selling points during our evaluations. Since the IPO, the company is nothing more than a musical chair for failing executives riding the cash cow BOD train. I wouldn't plan on seeing any real change with the product for the next 10 years -- if you've ever taken a peak at the DB design you might understand why there are so many failings on the presentation layer, and why it might take 10 years to fix Isn't it sad how software like Cacti, with a handful of active developers, can be so much more superior to most "enterprise" software? I love it.

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bwicks
Level 10

Re: Multiple pollers - one graph

DB design is by far the most ignored enhancement.  It should be at the top of the list above all enhancements... I Remember hearing in one of Josh's web-casts that 60 to 70% of all support calls reference the DB and or DB Performance.  With that said Solarwinds should be looking into a database design that breaks down tables into smaller chunks via Table Partitioning.  This would save everyone time and $$ both on the support side and customer side.  Not to mention the huge performance gain everywhere in the application/web.  I am sure the attempt of the "detailed", "hourly" and "Daily" tables helped everyone but this needs looked at again.

Thanks

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pserwe
Level 12

Re: Multiple pollers - one graph



I'm not sure why anyone even bothers requesting enhancements like this from Solarwinds. It's obvious these requests will never be addressed with anything other than "We're *planning* on adding it to the next release" or "I don't think that's representative of our user-base". So really, what's the point? The fact is, no matter how much you want to believe NPM, APM, or whaeverPM, is a mature "enterprise" product, their biggest claim to fame is that they have a user-driven support forum with over 38,000 users. WOW. It was one of the biggest selling points during our evaluations. Since the IPO, the company is nothing more than a musical chair for failing executives riding the cash cow BOD train. I wouldn't plan on seeing any real change with the product for the next 10 years -- if you've ever taken a peak at the DB design you might understand why there are so many failings on the presentation layer, and why it might take 10 years to fix Isn't it sad how software like Cacti, with a handful of active developers, can be so much more superior to most "enterprise" software? I love it.



 

I don't think that's an entirely fair statement.  Cacti is not 1/4 the tool NPM is on many levels.  Core feature of many opensource products in terms of presentation of complex data and proper handling of SNMP data for alerting, even if it comes from a table, is crucial and currently broken in SW and superior elsewhere.

It doesn't necessarily indicate an overall superiority, just a specific one.  The lack of Product's ability to address these issues in any sort of a reasonable fashion is a completely fair issue to pound on though.  It's been more than long enough.

Peter

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kirbini
Level 7

Re: Multiple pollers - one graph



I'm not sure why anyone even bothers requesting enhancements like this from Solarwinds. It's obvious these requests will never be addressed with anything other than "We're *planning* on adding it to the next release" or "I don't think that's representative of our user-base". So really, what's the point? The fact is, no matter how much you want to believe NPM, APM, or whaeverPM, is a mature "enterprise" product, their biggest claim to fame is that they have a user-driven support forum with over 38,000 users. WOW. It was one of the biggest selling points during our evaluations. Since the IPO, the company is nothing more than a musical chair for failing executives riding the cash cow BOD train. I wouldn't plan on seeing any real change with the product for the next 10 years -- if you've ever taken a peak at the DB design you might understand why there are so many failings on the presentation layer, and why it might take 10 years to fix Isn't it sad how software like Cacti, with a handful of active developers, can be so much more superior to most "enterprise" software? I love it.



 

Wow, it's like you read my mind 12 months ago.  I've been a user of Solar Winds products for nearly 15 years.  Back in the day they produced crappy looking but awesome tools for Windows net admins.  Netmaper, Visual Ping, router watch, etc were the only network tools available on WinNT or Win95 and they brought a lot of Windows admins into the network fold (where they eventually learned CLIs and then stopped using SW's Engineering tools, but I digress).  Sometime in the last 5 years or so however, SW has gone from a maker of quality (but crappy looking) engineering tools to a marketing company.  In 4 years we've had 5 different sales teams.  The focus has obviously switched from tools to sales.  Of course those of us who are requesting basic features get ignored because we don't represent as much revenue as a new customer.  It's as simple as that.  You know, "why should I have two blowout preventers when one borked one works most of the time?"

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tbilan
Level 8

Re: Multiple pollers - one graph

In the name of all that is holy please figure out how to graph information from multiple nodes on a single graph.

I too also liked the ugly tools.  They do what I want and that's why I bought them.  This workplace studio thing isn't something I asked for or expected and I have tried it several times but it feels too bulky.  I hope SW never gets rid of the individual lightweight tools. 

SW should do what they feel is best for their business.  I believe our Orion maintenance has been expired for at least 6 months.  I think the powers that be didn't feel that there was much there for us in version 10.  The multiple pollers in one graph issue is the top of our list.

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